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Post by mao on Nov 14, 2018 11:51:53 GMT -5
I like making up and toying w spells. In several of my settings I have taken higher spells and make them lower. The first one I did was dispel Magic, I made it second, surprisingly I did not have takers on this one.Later I made Planar Travel possible as 1st and second L spells that only went to specific planes, most commonly to the Dream Lands and my equivalent to astral plane. I am toying w teleport now.....
Anybody else?
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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Nov 16, 2018 14:06:22 GMT -5
I like making up and toying w spells. In several of my settings I have taken higher spells and make them lower. The first one I did was dispel Magic, I made it second, surprisingly I did not have takers on this one.Later I made Planar Travel possible as 1st and second L spells that only went to specific planes, most commonly to the Dream Lands and my equivalent to astral plane. I am toying w teleport now..... Anybody else? No, but only because I have yet see a need for it. I have considered making Read Language & Read Magic cantrips every magic user has access to. The only reason is how at least Read Magic is needed and at first or second level you are screwed if you don't have it, since discovering new spells or reading spell scrolls you need it and if you only have one or two slots and take Read Magic you are left with one less option. |
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Post by Warrior Twin Two on Nov 16, 2018 17:59:28 GMT -5
Watch out mao, you can really hurt yourself playing around with the teleport spell. I have made stronger versions of spells, but never weaker versions. |
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Post by mao on Nov 19, 2018 13:10:04 GMT -5
Watch out mao , you can really hurt yourself playing around with the teleport spell. I have made stronger versions of spells, but never weaker versions. I did a bunch of Magic Missile variants that were 2nd and 3rd |
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FaerieGodfather
Wanderer
Returned Home. Still returning to Humanity.
Posts: 46 
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Post by FaerieGodfather on Nov 22, 2018 0:09:46 GMT -5
The assumed power level of D&D spells really contains a lot of unspoken setting and... "game intention"... assumptions.
Changing them arbitrarily doesn't necessarily unbalance the game so much as rebalance the game by changing those assumptions. Teleportation magic is a lot cheaper in a shroompunk setting than in standard D&D, for instance...
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Post by ripx187 on Nov 26, 2018 16:24:33 GMT -5
This is an interesting idea, mao. I really dig it! I know that we played one campaign for somewhere around 10 years and only got up to 9th level. I have toyed with the idea of extra powerful spells for specific situations, but I've always given them in the form of a scroll else rewrote them to include components which were difficult or dangerous to find. A few years ago I had an idea but felt that the players should be 10th level, and I didn't want to wait so we all rolled up 10th level characters and went at it. The players ended up kicking my butt, I couldn't create any challenge for them what so ever, and they weren't enjoying the characters as at that level everything was unfamiliar to them, especially the expanded spell lists. It was just a frustrating ordeal all the way around. I haven't much experience DMing high-level campaigns, and it isn't as easy as I thought that it would be. I do think that if we could naturally get to the tenth level over time we could have pulled it off but we ourselves lacked the experience to do it. |
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Post by The Perilous Dreamer on Nov 26, 2018 20:11:14 GMT -5
ripx187, using scrolls is a good way to test out new spells that you have created or ones you've never used before to see how they fit into your game world.
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Post by bravewolf on Nov 26, 2018 22:30:28 GMT -5
ripx187, using scrolls is a good way to test out new spells that you have created or ones you've never used before to see how they fit into your game world. This is good advice. It's great to see you back here, TPD. Something that I've been dying to try is Lamentations of the Flame Princess's leveless spells. I won't get the chance anytime soon cos it really demands a wholly different campaign. To inject a more limited high-entropy element to our Arduin campaign, I stole an idea from Geoffrey McKinney: I planted one of the Teeth of Dahven-Mar (misspelled) in Stonehell Megadungeon. The Teeth are an artifact from the 1e DMG. The teeth are pretty innocuous on the power scale by themselves. In combination, they become much more powerful. A new 1st-level PC found the tooth recently and is investigating where to find others. The Teeth might break the campaign but it will be a long and winding road there! |
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Post by Harry Wolf on Nov 27, 2018 15:01:34 GMT -5
ripx187 , using scrolls is a good way to test out new spells that you have created or ones you've never used before to see how they fit into your game world. This is good advice. It's great to see you back here, TPD. Something that I've been dying to try is Lamentations of the Flame Princess's leveless spells. I won't get the chance anytime soon cos it really demands a wholly different campaign. To inject a more limited high-entropy element to our Arduin campaign, I stole an idea from Geoffrey McKinney: I planted one of the Teeth of Dahven-Mar (misspelled) in Stonehell Megadungeon. The Teeth are an artifact from the 1e DMG. The teeth are pretty innocuous on the power scale by themselves. In combination, they become much more powerful. A new 1st-level PC found the tooth recently and is investigating where to find others. The Teeth might break the campaign but it will be a long and winding road there! Why don't you start a project thread and work on the wholly different campaign there as you feel the itch. Seems like it might spawn a lot of ideas. And I would like to hear more about those level less spells. |
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Post by bravewolf on Nov 27, 2018 20:19:26 GMT -5
This is good advice. It's great to see you back here, TPD. Something that I've been dying to try is Lamentations of the Flame Princess's leveless spells. I won't get the chance anytime soon cos it really demands a wholly different campaign. To inject a more limited high-entropy element to our Arduin campaign, I stole an idea from Geoffrey McKinney: I planted one of the Teeth of Dahven-Mar (misspelled) in Stonehell Megadungeon. The Teeth are an artifact from the 1e DMG. The teeth are pretty innocuous on the power scale by themselves. In combination, they become much more powerful. A new 1st-level PC found the tooth recently and is investigating where to find others. The Teeth might break the campaign but it will be a long and winding road there! Why don't you start a project thread and work on the wholly different campaign there as you feel the itch. Seems like it might spawn a lot of ideas. And I would like to hear more about those level less spells. All righty, I will see what I can do. If anybody wants to see what levelless spells look like in the B/X clone Lamentations of the Flame Princess, just go to lotfp.com and look for the link to a pay-what-you-want PDF of Vaginas Are Magic. The levelless magic system is given in the book's frontispiece. |
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Post by bravewolf on Nov 30, 2018 1:35:05 GMT -5
OD&D (3LBBs) with Level-less Spells a la LotFP
I wasn't planning to make a project of this, so I am planting it here for the time being.
Note that this material is adapted from James Raggi IV's Vaginas Are Magic. Lamentations of the Flame Princess, 2017.
THERE ARE NO SPELL LEVELS
All spells are considered equally difficult, & the level of the spell’s power is determined by the character's caster level. The caster does not have to cast a spell at full power; she may decide to cast it at a lower level of power (a 5th level caster choosing to cast a spell as if she was a 3rd level caster, for instance).
BEGINNING SPELLS
1st-level Magic-Users begin with three randomly determined spells from the entire spell list of the campaign. There is no Read Magic. Clerics & anti-clerics receive a religious text with two randomly determined spells in it at 2nd level.
PREPARING SPELLS EACH DAY
Magic-Users can prepare/memorize one different spell per caster level. Clerics & anti-clerics can do so also but at experience level - 1. These can be prepared from the caster’s own spellbook, or any understood spell scrolls or spellbooks created by other Magic-Users or clerical types.
TRANSCRIBING SPELLS
All spellbooks are written in a language. There is no “magical language,” although spellbooks are often written in a personalized code. Comprehend Languages will always allow the reading of a spellbook or scroll. For purposes of spell transcription (& all other research-type activities), consider spells to be 3rd level.
CASTING SPELLS
Magic-Users have one spell slot per caster level that they can use with no risk or penalty; the clerical type has one spell slot per caster level - 1. Spell casters can use any number of prepared spells in any combination up to their casting limit before they must prepare spells again. For example, they can cast every spell they have prepared once, or one spell multiple times, or any combination thereof, as long as they don’t hit their casting limit. One may not cast a spell after delaying an action in a combat round. Note that in the spell description, the “subject” is the direct target of the spell.
RISKY CASTING
Spells can be cast under conditions that risk catastrophe. When one of the following conditions is met, the spell may still be attempted. However, the caster must make a saving throw vs. Staves & Spells. On a failure, roll on the Miscast table. Spells cannot be ended early on a Miscast. Every additional valid condition means a –1 penalty on the saving throw.
1. Casting a spell after the usual level-based casting limit has been reached.
2. Casting a spell that has not been prepared that day (this can only be attempted with a spell that is in the caster’s own spellbook).
3. Casting a spell that is being read directly from an understood scroll or spellbook, that is not by the caster’s own hand, that has not been prepared that day.
4. Casting a spell while carrying beyond the safe level of encumbrance (Light foot).
5. Casting a spell the same round as taking damage (non-instantaneous spells may still be affected after casting, but before the spell takes effect!)
Miscast results are rolled when the spell takes effect, not before. Results are rolled by the Referee & revealed only when the characters involved become aware of the consequences. Casters may miscast on purpose, but the player may never choose the miscast result.
Miscast Table (roll 1d12)
1-6. Effect custom to the specific spell.
7. An extradimensional entity has slipped into this reality through a hole created by the casting attempt. Treat as if the LotFP Summon spell has been cast (or Conjure Elemental from OD&D) with the creature having Hit Dice equal to the level of the spell originally attempted +1d4. The creature is automatically out of control.
8. An entirely different spell has been cast. Randomly determine what spell was cast from the campaign spell list (reroll if the intended spell comes up) with a 1d10 effective caster level. If the spell requires a specific target or target area, determine this randomly.
9. Uncontrolled extradimensional radiation floods an area equal to the intended spell level x 20’ radius. Every biological creature of at least one Hit Die (except the caster) suffers 1d6 damage. The sum of the damage done is pooled together, & this pool of damage heals the caster up to maximum hit points, but all remaining damage beyond that is subtracted back from the caster’s hit points.
10. The misappropriation of magical energy causes time to slide ahead:
If play is in “slow time” (wilderness exploration, staying put in a particular location for healing or research purposes, or any such gameplay where time passes at a great rate), then 1d6 days for every spell level passes instantly. All characters within 20’ staying in the same place the entire time. Any environmental effects of the character being in that spot unmoving for that many days are instantly applied (for instance, if they are in an unforgiving tundra, they will suffer the results of 1d6 days of cold exposure). The characters are then affected as if they have not eaten or slept in that entire time.
If play is in “medium time” (such as dungeon exploration or any game play where time is measured in 10 minute turns), then 1d6 turns per spell level pass instantly. All characters within 20’ stay in the same place the entire time. Light sources are expended, encounter checks are made, and any effect of the characters being in that spot unmoving for that period of time are instantly applied.
If play is in “fast time” (such as combat or any game play where time is measured in 1-minute rounds), every biological being within 20’, including the caster, rolls 1d6 per spell level, and is effectively paralyzed for that many rounds.
11. Odd & alien light floods a 100’ area, destructive & harmful to physical life, but so strange that biological bodies don’t know the proper response to the harm suffered. Bodies therefore guess at how they are supposed to respond to the malignant force, deciding to “remember” the last damage suffered & recreate that to express the harm caused by the light. Every character within the area re-suffers the last damage inflicted upon them. If the specific damage suffered cannot be remembered, then surely the foe that caused it can be; assume maximum damage was suffered. If even that cannot be remembered, the character suffers 1d20 points of damage. If a character has never before suffered hit point damage and is subject to this effect, it does no damage and instead doubles their maximum (and current) hit point amount.
12. Microscopic organisms floating in the air are engorged with strange energies, growing large enough to be seen & emitting glowing hues. They pass through all matter freely & devour all perishables (food, oil, torches, ammunition, gunpowder, basically any item individually accounted for & expended in a character’s inventory, money and other such valuables excepted) within a 10’ per spell level radius
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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Nov 30, 2018 13:56:35 GMT -5
Looks good bravewolf, I am a fan of Lamentations of the Flame Princess - it is the only Ascending AC version of D&D I'll likely run. |
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Post by bravewolf on Nov 30, 2018 14:40:07 GMT -5
Looks good bravewolf, I am a fan of Lamentations of the Flame Princess - it is the only Ascending AC version of D&D I'll likely rgun. Thanks. I made a few changes to Raggi's text to reflect assumptions I'd make if I used the scheme in OD&D. For instance, that cleric-types learn their spells from books, too. |
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