Spinoff - "riveted into adventures"

[hengest]

Also from the RJK interview:

For example, very, very early on our party in Greyhawk Castle encountered the black pudding for the first time. We had no clue. It was new. So we hacked on it to begin with. Ooops! We were out of place and time, we had no information about it, and there it was splitting into parts that began climbing all over us. Collectively we were terrified and all of our faces were living question marks; and of course that was Gary’s intent for us. Here is where newness and wonder and doubt and terror merge to create the immersion in Fantasy, and that’s what I aim to accomplish with my designs. Designers and DMs don’t need their players casually engaged while nonchalantly passing around a bag of chips. Players need to be riveted into adventures and at the very least anxiously (or even fearfully) inspecting their character sheets and not dismissively or passively paging through the Monster Manual or the PHB for their “way out of” a situation. It’s called being there. You can either be gathered around the table or be gathered to the imagination. With immersive design you get both; and that takes extra time for me to achieve, to create all of this new “stuff.” But it rarely disappoints.

This is one of my favorite quotes from RJK because he gives an actual example from bitd that supports his theoretical take.  

"Riveted into adventures" is what I am always imagining and hoping for in my attempts at design and planning (despite having no players atm).  

I was not there at the beginning of the hobby as RJK was.  But I do try to track certain cultural trends from around the same period through today where we can observe directly what is happening.  Overall I see a general replacement of engagement by the appearance of being engaged.  I see replacement of knowledge by the appearance of knowledge.  I see replacement of communication and social activities by pseudo-socializing.  A forum like this where people actually talk to each other I would call a kind of computer-mediated socializing, but as we all know there is plenty of nominally "social" activity online that is actually anti-social.

So I say this not to complain about the wider culture (I think this post is still generally on-topic), but simply to say that there is some precious seed that has been preserved in gaming and even if a lot of tabletop games now are not exactly my style, it is still good that people play them and it is good to look back at the dawn of the hobby -- not to imitate exactly what they did but to do something new, surprising, vital, riveting.  

[Admin Pete]

I think gaming especially face to face gaming is vital for preserving the art of immersive activities and of immersive social interaction. Those things are dying out and without it being passed on, it may be a long time before it is rediscovered.

It’s called being there.

Few people these days know what "being there" is. I think forums like this one where people can talk and discuss and create together over extended periods of time is where our culture is being preserved and can reseed the country when the time is right from those of us who remember the real world and the way it was and hopefully will be again someday.

[hengest]

A fine hope to hold for the hobby and the country (and other countries as well). Have an Exalt, Admin Pete!

[The Editor]

Apr 5, 2021 10:16:11 GMT -5 hengest said:

This is one of my favorite quotes from RJK because he gives an actual example from bitd that supports his theoretical take.  

When RJK gives actual examples to support his theoretical take is where he shines, I am not sure that he realizes that. He needs to spend less time writing and assuming that people will get it and more time explaining himself with examples. The art of making oneself understood is undervalued and its lack is an common failing of all types of people.  Almost all of us, when we have an idea, suffer from thinking everyone else will see it as clearly as we do.

[hengest]

Apr 25, 2021 20:27:29 GMT -5 The Editor said:

Apr 5, 2021 10:16:11 GMT -5 hengest said:

This is one of my favorite quotes from RJK because he gives an actual example from bitd that supports his theoretical take.  

When RJK gives actual examples to support his theoretical take is where he shines, I am not sure that he realizes that. He needs to spend less time writing and assuming that people will get it and more time explaining himself with examples. The art of making oneself understood is undervalued and its lack is an common failing of all types of people.  Almost all of us, when we have an idea, suffer from thinking everyone else will see it as clearly as we do.

I firmly believe that RJK has a lot of knowledge and even the kind of knowledge that composts into wisdom about these matters.  However, when he posted around here more regularly, I often had a lot of difficulty following the details of his thought.  I can usually follow speech and writing pretty well, so this stuck out to me, because it was obvious he wasn't talking nonsense.  I would guess that he has (understandably) largely talked to himself in his head as he has processed these matters over the past fifty years and it's hard for him to talk in a way that doesn't assume that background. In the one field where I know anything, I am like this and I try hard to make sure I am intelligible (sometimes it even works).  

This is one reason I like working on the creative stuff I am allowed to do on this forum: instead of explaining something or talking ABOUT something, the purpose of the writing is to present something (somewhat) new.  The writing is the topic instead of being about a different topic.  That is new for me and while I am not great at it, the experience is extremel valuable to me.  To bring it back to the OP here, I guess for me, that's kind of "being there" in a way I'm usually not.  

[The Editor]

Apr 25, 2021 22:02:51 GMT -5 hengest said:

I firmly believe that RJK has a lot of knowledge and even the kind of knowledge that composts into wisdom about these matters.  However, when he posted around here more regularly, I often had a lot of difficulty following the details of his thought.  I can usually follow speech and writing pretty well, so this stuck out to me, because it was obvious he wasn't talking nonsense.  I would guess that he has (understandably) largely talked to himself in his head as he has processed these matters over the past fifty years and it's hard for him to talk in a way that doesn't assume that background. In the one field where I know anything, I am like this and I try hard to make sure I am intelligible (sometimes it even works).

My guess is that he has a certain persona online, I have often wondered how he talks over a beer. I would hazard a guess that he gets way more chatty and understandable shooting the breeze over a beer. 

Apr 25, 2021 22:02:51 GMT -5 hengest said:

This is one reason I like working on the creative stuff I am allowed to do on this forum: instead of explaining something or talking ABOUT something, the purpose of the writing is to present something (somewhat) new.  The writing is the topic instead of being about a different topic.  That is new for me and while I am not great at it, the experience is extremely valuable to me.  To bring it back to the OP here, I guess for me, that's kind of "being there" in a way I'm usually not.

We think you are great at it, while I am sure the experience is extremely valuable to you, it is not because you are in anyway deficient.

[The Perilous Dreamer]

Apr 26, 2021 0:30:19 GMT -5 The Editor said:

Apr 25, 2021 22:02:51 GMT -5 hengest said:

I firmly believe that RJK has a lot of knowledge and even the kind of knowledge that composts into wisdom about these matters.  However, when he posted around here more regularly, I often had a lot of difficulty following the details of his thought.  I can usually follow speech and writing pretty well, so this stuck out to me, because it was obvious he wasn't talking nonsense.  I would guess that he has (understandably) largely talked to himself in his head as he has processed these matters over the past fifty years and it's hard for him to talk in a way that doesn't assume that background. In the one field where I know anything, I am like this and I try hard to make sure I am intelligible (sometimes it even works).

My guess is that he has a certain persona online, I have often wondered how he talks over a beer. I would hazard a guess that he gets way more chatty and understandable shooting the breeze over a beer. 

Apr 25, 2021 22:02:51 GMT -5 hengest said:

This is one reason I like working on the creative stuff I am allowed to do on this forum: instead of explaining something or talking ABOUT something, the purpose of the writing is to present something (somewhat) new.  The writing is the topic instead of being about a different topic.  That is new for me and while I am not great at it, the experience is extremely valuable to me.  To bring it back to the OP here, I guess for me, that's kind of "being there" in a way I'm usually not.

We think you are great at it, while I am sure the experience is extremely valuable to you, it is not because you are in anyway deficient.

See the bold, I would hazard a guess that you are right about that. His private emails to me were of a different tone than the posts and that is with us never having met in person.

[The Perilous Dreamer]

To me that is the prime benefit of OD&D, "being there" being "riveted into adventures" and then crafting a game session with your players that gives them the same rollercoaster of emotions that they would experience if it were really real. I want my players to get caught up in the game like that.