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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Aug 20, 2018 2:48:59 GMT -5
This thread is for discussing OOC topics that will distract from the main thread.
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Post by raikenclw on Aug 20, 2018 15:51:05 GMT -5
Anyone remember where I posted my character pic for Sora? I wanted to post this to the main thread for Chet's benefit, but Photobucket is being uncooperative at the moment, so I thought I would quote/copy/paste the link from that earlier post.
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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Aug 20, 2018 22:14:42 GMT -5
Anyone remember where I posted my character pic for Sora? I wanted to post this to the main thread for Chet's benefit, but Photobucket is being uncooperative at the moment, so I thought I would quote/copy/paste the link from that earlier post. Here it is raikenclw.
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Post by raikenclw on Aug 21, 2018 21:30:28 GMT -5
Anyone remember where I posted my character pic for Sora? I wanted to post this to the main thread for Chet's benefit, but Photobucket is being uncooperative at the moment, so I thought I would quote/copy/paste the link from that earlier post. Here it is raikenclw . Thanks. But I don't appear to have a "Quote" function on that thread. I suspect it's been locked. I'll try photobucket again. Maybe it's got its mind back, now.
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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Aug 21, 2018 22:44:58 GMT -5
raikenclw I posted it for you, I am not sure why the quote function wouldn't work for you, but you can ask the admin to see if anything is wrong.
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Post by El Borak on Aug 22, 2018 8:08:58 GMT -5
raikenclw I posted it for you, I am not sure why the quote function wouldn't work for you, but you can ask the admin to see if anything is wrong. The link is to a locked thread and that is why players cannot quote. It is Part 01 of the adventure and it was locked when you moved to Part 02 of the adventure.
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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Aug 22, 2018 12:13:59 GMT -5
Well i'll unlock it then, that is lame. I thought locking a thread meant you couldn't post...noobie mod fails LOL. Well this is good training for if I ever run my own forum.
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Post by raikenclw on Aug 22, 2018 21:40:02 GMT -5
. . . Paladins are supposed to be the good guys . . . I just realized that we might be having a perceptional disconnect among the players, here. It was my understanding that this setting has a simplified alignment scale, similar to what Basic Dungeons & Dragons used, way back. Specifically, there are only two alignments: Order versus Chaos. Most gods/religions support one or the other. Sora worships Mulvigg, who supports Order. Order is NOT the same thing as "good" or "polite" or "humble." Order can be cruel. Correct, GM?
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Post by Mighty Darci on Aug 22, 2018 23:56:41 GMT -5
Well i'll unlock it then, that is lame. I thought locking a thread meant you couldn't post...noobie mod fails LOL. Well this is good training for if I ever run my own forum. When you lock a thread, I believe that only mods can do anything with the thread.
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Post by Mighty Darci on Aug 23, 2018 0:01:45 GMT -5
. . . Paladins are supposed to be the good guys . . . I just realized that we might be having a perceptional disconnect among the players, here. It was my understanding that this setting has a simplified alignment scale, similar to what Basic Dungeons & Dragons used, way back. Specifically, there are only two alignments: Order versus Chaos. Most gods/religions support one or the other. Sora worships Mulvigg, who supports Order. Order is NOT the same thing as "good" or "polite" or "humble." Order can be cruel. Correct, GM? The disconnect is thinking that the halflings understand the nuances of humans and the alignments, they are just uneducated, outcasts who don't know the things that Sora takes for granted. They only know the stories (lies) they have been told. They are not integrated into human society, they are outsiders looking in and so will make lots of mistakes and misinterpretations, it is who they are. So there is a disconnect by design of these characters. If Sora kills Karba or knocks her unconscious, Togork on seeing her dead or assuming her dead will attack Sora to satisfy his hunger to kill. Logical thought is not very high on Togork list of things to do.
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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Aug 23, 2018 0:20:00 GMT -5
. . . Paladins are supposed to be the good guys . . . I just realized that we might be having a perceptional disconnect among the players, here. It was my understanding that this setting has a simplified alignment scale, similar to what Basic Dungeons & Dragons used, way back. Specifically, there are only two alignments: Order versus Chaos. [Ref Voice: Wrong, there is Neutrality as well.]Most gods/religions support one or the other. Sora worships Mulvigg, who supports Order. Order is NOT the same thing as "good" or "polite" or "humble." [Ref Voice: Correct. Law = Order, it can be either benign or tyrannical in nature. Thus, the following statement is also correct.] Order can be cruel. Correct, GM? Clerics & Paladins are Lawful servants of not only their deity but defenders the civilized world & the Laws of those civilized cultures. Some deities interpet Law in a more benign way. Mulvigg clerics & paladins defend travelers from threats they cannot defend against and this goes especially for Merchants and trade, except outlawed trade in a given culture they are in. If Slavery is legal they will defend slavers as long as they are in such a region but where it is outlawed they will hunt them down for violating the local laws. Neutrality is those who are not against or for either Law or Chaos. Usually they are seen as part of the whole, your average citizen is Neutral. Chaos is for anarchy, of the rule of nature unrestricted, madness born out of the corrupted nature of chaos, but could represent well meaning opponents of brutal tyranny.
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Post by Mighty Darci on Aug 23, 2018 0:31:38 GMT -5
Given the above three of the halflings are neutral with some shading of Law and of Chaos. Togork is kinda neutral but has some Law - he defers, mostly, to Gwindeth as to who he can kill and not run afoul of human Law. He also falls under Chaos tendencies that could eventually gain the under hand, part of that is the "could represent well meaning opponents of brutal tyranny". But all four are mostly just selfish and out for gold and loot.
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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Aug 23, 2018 0:39:52 GMT -5
I just realized that we might be having a perceptional disconnect among the players, here. It was my understanding that this setting has a simplified alignment scale, similar to what Basic Dungeons & Dragons used, way back. Specifically, there are only two alignments: Order versus Chaos. Most gods/religions support one or the other. Sora worships Mulvigg, who supports Order. Order is NOT the same thing as "good" or "polite" or "humble." Order can be cruel. Correct, GM? The disconnect is thinking that the halflings understand the nuances of humans and the alignments, they are just uneducated, outcasts who don't know the things that Sora takes for granted. They only know the stories (lies) they have been told. They are not integrated into human society, they are outsiders looking in and so will make lots of mistakes and misinterpretations, it is who they are. So there is a disconnect by design of these characters. If Sora kills Karba or knocks her unconscious, Togork on seeing her dead or assuming her dead will attack Sora to satisfy his hunger to kill. Logical thought is not very high on Togork list of things to do. This could be true, as neutrality is very open to how it is represented. Neutral outcasts like half-blooded Orcs & Ogre-kin in the party, likely are ignorant of the niceties of Law for their often ill treatment, seeing it and civilization as oppressive but not to the point of opposing actively as a chaotic would. There is a reason Lawful Paladins are less likely to ally to non-Lawful folk, they are even more vigilant defenders of Order than even their Cleric kin. That said, the "halflings" are people Sora chose to ally with on this mission AND the "Halflings" chose to travel with him. Take that in mind. Sora though should bristle at an insult to his deity, but this is a traveler, who is not threatening the group - just rude is still under Mulvigg's protection. Thus she is to be to be protected as part of Sora & Josaih's sworn duty, unless she proves to be chaotic or a threat to the party. Also raikenclw remember Mighty Darci 's posted comments in red concerning her characters thoughts are noted OOC thus not known to Sora, so try to not take them as actionable if & until Darci's characters act on them if they ever do. I am trying to be fair & impartial here.
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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Aug 23, 2018 0:43:28 GMT -5
Given the above three of the halflings are neutral with some shading of Law and of Chaos. Togork is kinda neutral but has some Law - he defers, mostly, to Gwindeth as to who he can kill and not run afoul of human Law. He also falls under Chaos tendencies that could eventually gain the under hand, part of that is the "could represent well meaning opponents of brutal tyranny". But all four are mostly just selfish and out for gold and loot. This is perfectly acceptable - but understand there are ramifications for actions (the same goes for Sora - if he violates his oath and tenets of his faith - such as attacking a innocent traveler).
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Post by raikenclw on Aug 23, 2018 1:12:51 GMT -5
there are ramifications for actions (the same goes for Sora - if he violates his oath and tenets of his faith - such as attacking a innocent traveler). Sora would submit to punishment by his Order, if necessary. But he sees this as unlikely, for simple (non-lethal, non-permanent) chastisement of a blasphemer.
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Post by raikenclw on Aug 23, 2018 1:19:24 GMT -5
a traveler, who is not threatening the group - just rude is still under Mulvigg's protection. Thus she is to be to be protected as part of Sora & Josaih's sworn duty, unless she proves to be chaotic or a threat to the party. Do not Mulvigg's faithful have a responsibility to show such a traveller the error of their ways? This *particular* traveller is being not just insulting but also deliberately evasive. In Sora's eyes, she's behaving like a juvenile delinquent being questioned by a beat cop. Her continual attempts to avoid answering Sora's questions makes him increasingly suspicious of her motivations and basic truthfulness. Her readily evident belligerence does not help her case.
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Post by raikenclw on Aug 23, 2018 1:26:15 GMT -5
Request for clarification: just how medieval are we? Is the setting more akin to the Society for Creative Anachronism (e.g. a highly sanitized view of history)? Is it based in grim reality (e.g. where the Law took a hand from those who stole so much as a loaf of bread)? Or somewhere in between?
At the moment, Sora's intentions fall more on the SCA side of the scales than the Grim Realism side. If Mighty Darci's crew really is as rough and uncivilized as she's stating, they should be surprised that Sora is behaving so relatively MILDLY after declaring himself insulted. While his reason for insult may seem silly to them, "barbarian" cultures should be quite used to haughty warrior types getting insulted over the least little thing and demanding bloody satisfaction in response.
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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Aug 23, 2018 2:29:22 GMT -5
Request for clarification: just how medieval are we? Is the setting more akin to the Society for Creative Anachronism (e.g. a highly sanitized view of history)? Is it based in grim reality (e.g. where the Law took a hand from those who stole so much as a loaf of bread)? Or somewhere in between? At the moment, Sora's intentions fall more on the SCA side of the scales than the Grim Realism side. If Mighty Darci's crew really is as rough and uncivilized as she's stating, they should be surprised that Sora is behaving so relatively MILDLY after declaring himself insulted. While his reason for insult may seem silly to them, "barbarian" cultures should be quite used to haughty warrior types getting insulted over the least little thing and demanding bloody satisfaction in response. Not SCA as I often run grim campaigns I am just stating because of the peculiarities of Mulvigg's faith Clerics & paladin's will not strike travelers unless attacked or in defense of others - UNLESS they truly believe or a spell/prayer shows that they are chaotic aligned . They won't take blasphemy well and may well chastise the offender, if it leads to violence they can defend themselves believing that the attackers are agents of chaos. I do not see Sora's actions or words violating his oath in anyway. Thieves, bandits, pirates are the sworn enemy of Mulvigg's servants, so questioning and chastisement of Karba in order to 1) deal with her rudeness and 2) ascertain if she is a bandit lurking in a ruins is perfectly reasonable. That said, if others see it as bulling and act according to their character's view of the situation it is something the party will need to deal with. I will not punish Sora for his actions unless they violate his faith. I was just letting you know of how Mulvigg expects his servants to act.
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Post by Mighty Darci on Aug 23, 2018 8:24:07 GMT -5
Request for clarification: just how medieval are we? Is the setting more akin to the Society for Creative Anachronism (e.g. a highly sanitized view of history)? Is it based in grim reality (e.g. where the Law took a hand from those who stole so much as a loaf of bread)? Or somewhere in between? At the moment, Sora's intentions fall more on the SCA side of the scales than the Grim Realism side. If Mighty Darci's crew really is as rough and uncivilized as she's stating, they should be surprised that Sora is behaving so relatively MILDLY after declaring himself insulted. While his reason for insult may seem silly to them, "barbarian" cultures should be quite used to haughty warrior types getting insulted over the least little thing and demanding bloody satisfaction in response. Remember they are surprised as they have been led to believe otherwise, by a priest and humans that preach something entirely different from the order Sora is from. The fine distinction of multiple creeds by different orders of priests serving different gods is not something they have thought about or considered. Haughty corrupt dishonest nobles and priests they know. For them haughty is identically equal to corrupt and dishonest as they always seem to go together. So the priest that preached otherwise, they thought must be the real deal and the other priests are the common scammers, just as almost all nobles are just scammers fleecing the common folks. They are looking at Sora's exterior, nothing in his "appearance" says he has a "right" to behave this way. He doesn't look like he belongs to the in crowd. That is why when they heard he was a paladin, they expected what the odd priest talked about. Not the normal haughty touchy prickly corrupt dishonest types. They will gradually come to believe he is just another one that can't be trusted because he thinks he and his god are better than anyone else, and they will have even less respect for him, but be much more wary of him and will watch their backs even more than they normally do. The more they come to respect his ability as a warrior, the less they will trust him and if they defer to him in anyway, it will be lip service solely because of Human Society and the threat of LAW against their kind.
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Post by raikenclw on Aug 23, 2018 11:33:10 GMT -5
The more they come to respect his ability as a warrior, the less they will trust him and if they defer to him in anyway, it will be lip service solely because of Human Society and the threat of LAW against their kind. <shrug> Seems like a fairly harsh judgement on someone who has only asked for an apology, but have it your way. NOTE: As a paladin, Sora feels that normal laws apply to his actions only insofar as these agree with the teachings of the Church of Mulvigg. Should the two differ, he will abide by the tenets of his faith. Note also that - while he will cooperate with "civilian" priests of Mulvigg to the furthest extent possible - he will only accept commands from his superiors in his Order. Perhaps (once his uncivilized companions have learned something about the multitude of churches among humans) our kind GM can arrange an encounter between Sora and a corrupt priest of Mulvigg. After watching Sora strip the fellow naked, beat him soundly and then donate his personal wealth to the poor they might change their minds.
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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Aug 23, 2018 12:30:30 GMT -5
Note to Mighty Darci, mormonyoyoman & raikenclw - I'll be away from the internet until probably 10pm as I am going to be across town for my first session of face-to-face gaming in months. I am not ignoring developments as I just have zero time to respond in any way. See you later.
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Post by mormonyoyoman on Aug 23, 2018 13:12:11 GMT -5
[Congratulations, Ebon! When you return, please tell us about your real world simulated fantasy adventure. (WHA'D I say??)]
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Post by mormonyoyoman on Aug 23, 2018 13:30:09 GMT -5
By the way, thanks to everyone for showing me where this thread is. My tablet thought it was the same thread as the similarly named original. she's behaving like a juvenile delinquent being questioned by a beat cop. (There. You now get her character. She sees cops, priests, and most men as bullies, just like most JDs with which I've worked.) (Karba's heard no questions, merely orders. To most people, and especially one such as Sora, the threat of "or ELSE" is a part of orders.) (I feel badly revealing this much of Karba's unspoken thoughts. Or is the paladin using a mind reading spell? If so, Karba is disturbingly susceptible to magic.)
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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Aug 23, 2018 23:38:54 GMT -5
[Congratulations, Ebon! When you return, please tell us about your real world simulated fantasy adventure. (WHA'D I say??)] It went as well as I expected knowing who was playing & the Ref. It reinforced my desire never to play 5e D&D again after the next 3-4 sessions. I can't stand the build mentality it fosters, though it is far better than 3.5 D&D & Pathfinder. Luckily for me we had several healing potions and I had my Wild Shape Druid powers.
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Post by raikenclw on Aug 24, 2018 0:29:53 GMT -5
Intelligence 16, Wisdom 13 Doesn't sound all that dense to me. But she's your PC. For instance, she didn't notice she spit. Even after a threatening Sora stares first at her fresh glob of spittle, then tracks his gaze upward from there to stare at her face? Yeah. Karba's definitely missing a few bits of reality, now and again. And then there's the whole burying of the "baby" bit. So definitely not our party scout, then.
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Post by raikenclw on Aug 24, 2018 0:33:35 GMT -5
(I feel badly revealing this much of Karba's unspoken thoughts. Or is the paladin using a mind reading spell? If so, Karba is disturbingly susceptible to magic.) Sora knows nothing of her inner thoughts. He's just going by her extremely odd and quite evidently disconnected from reality external behavior. He has seen the effects of violent trauma on survivors before and he's therefore now classifying her as functionally insane.
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Post by mormonyoyoman on Aug 24, 2018 1:54:07 GMT -5
(I feel badly revealing this much of Karba's unspoken thoughts. Or is the paladin using a mind reading spell? If so, Karba is disturbingly susceptible to magic.) Sora knows nothing of her inner thoughts. He's just going by her extremely odd and quite evidently disconnected from reality external behavior. He has seen the effects of violent trauma on survivors before and he's therefore now classifying her as functionally insane. You may be correct. She is based on a friend of 50 years.
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Post by raikenclw on Aug 26, 2018 15:24:11 GMT -5
I'll hint at things but I'll rarely portray certain things in scene, as I'd rather your imagination fill the gaps. Just a thought to my fellow players: When we decide on what our imagination decides to put into such gaps, *please* articulate these in your posts. Imagination is excellent, but if we all end up imagining different things, disaster is certain.
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Post by raikenclw on Aug 26, 2018 15:26:56 GMT -5
Would it be possible to start a separate thread for our arrival at the ruins?
As noted previously, play can continue in this thread at the same (real world) time, if character interactions are not quite completed to the satisfaction of all. But the general shape of the party has not been (more or less) determined.
GM: If you want to have two additional Order members awaiting us at the ruins, I am content for you to create them however you prefer.
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Post by Hexenritter Verlag on Aug 26, 2018 17:00:37 GMT -5
I'll hint at things but I'll rarely portray certain things in scene, as I'd rather your imagination fill the gaps. Just a thought to my fellow players: When we decide on what our imagination decides to put into such gaps, *please* articulate these in your posts. Imagination is excellent, but if we all end up imagining different things, disaster is certain. I think things will be self-evident but not spelled out in graphical nature when I leave such gaps so it is up to you if you spell out these things. I include things that make sense in a world of monsters and where darkness creeps within the hearts of men.
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