The Q&A with Jeff Berry aka chirinebakal 886 pages and

[True Black Raven]

A ton of great content by Jeff Berry aka @chirinebakal can be found in his Q&A threads over at theRPGsite there are currently 886 pages and counting. As far as I know this is the longest Q&A by any of the guys who where there bitd.

Questioning chirine ba kal - Part I - 600 pages

Questioning chirine ba kal - part II - 283 pages

Questioning chirine ba kal - part III - newly started

The next five posts after this one is to provide context for the start of the first Q&A thread.

[True Black Raven]

To put this all in some context see this thread. @chirinebakal was asking to have his account closed and he stated

In reviewing my various forum accounts, I have realized that I really do not use my account here in any meaningful way. I am, I think, simply too old; the discussions are, in the main, quite over my head as I simply do not play any of the games that are under discussion. I do not play D&D, for example, and probably never have over the past forty years; I played something called "Blackmoor" with Dave Arneson. something called "Greyhawk" with Gary Gygax, and something called "Tekumel" with Prof. Barker.



From what I can tell, my play style and gaming is no longer relevant or resonates with modern gamers. My perception is that I am wasting people's time and your bandwidth, so if you could, please close my account.



Thanks!

First he is not old, in todays world he is barely middle aged. People more than ever need to know about something called "Blackmoor" with Dave Arneson. something called "Greyhawk" with Gary Gygax, and something called "Tekumel" with Prof. Barker.


If his play style and gaming is no longer relevant or resonates with modern gamers, that is to their shame. History and roots are always relevant and should always resonate with people.

A number of comments were made and some of them were so wrong.  I thought this one hit the right note

For the love of the gods DO NOT be discouraged by what a handful of fanatics on a website of a fringe hobby think or say (or don't say).

and

Even if you're not into newer games, I'm sure there's a lot of people here in particular who'd be very interested in hearing your experiences with older games.

@chirinebakal then said

I'm not a 'gamer'. I've looked at all the various rules sets that have come out over the years, and - with one exception, "Arrows of Indra", they do nothing for me. I've looked in on local D&D, Pathfinder, and similar groups, and the endless rules debates bore me to tears. Sorry.

Really? I have yet to see that interest, which is why I've dropped off a dozen forums over the past couple of years.

I find the state of the hobby in general discouraging; again, sorry. I am finding that I have no interest in the discussions that I see go by; there's just nothing there for me.

My experience has been that there is very little - if any - interest in our "loosey-goosey", "hand-wavy" sort of game play that we used to do here in the Twin Cities back in the day; not just here, but on all of the forums that i've sampled. These days, it all seems to be about rules systems and game mechanics, and I just can't seem to get into the plethora of discussions about this kind of thing that I see go by. Aside from a promising discussion about how I run 'Braunsteins' on another forum, there just hasn't been any evidence of the possible interest you mention.

I am delighted that you had a fun time with the threads on Braunsteins - they are a lot of fun to run and to play in, and I've loved them for years.

I'm not a rules / mechanics kind of guy; I think that's largely because back in the day, we didn't have many sets of rules to work with, and tended to simply make it up as we went along. We used our experience knowledge - there were some quite formidable scholars playing at Coffman Union in those days - and just got out there and played the game.

I think quite a few of us could agree and emphasize with these statements. I have always wondered just how you run a Braunstein and what kind of knowledge base you need to do it justice.

[True Black Raven]

Phil's creation is indeed a wonder, and I'm very sorry to have discovered that is has the reputation that it seems to have with most gamers these days. We had a lot of fun in Phil's campaign - it was very much "A Princess Of Mars" meets swashbuckler movies meets high fantasy and classic 'scientifiction'. You didn't need a degree in a constructed language, either; we just got out there and tried to survive. And yes, there is a curse for book thieves - I've had to use it a few times, over the years.

Re age, I don't play RPGs. I don't play miniatures, either, although there are something like 5,000 little lead people in the basement. Nor do I play board games; I think of myself as a model builder, first and foremost, who happens to be able to spend some of his time in some amazing world-settings.

And I think that's what may be the crux of the matter; back in the day, we played anything and everything - the division of the hobby into very separate and distinct genres didn't exist for us. We moved across a spectrum of play that included all of what are now the various genres - we played what we needed to play in order to make things happen.

As an example of this, we had one very memorable WWII game where I was playing the Allies on a table in one room, using "Tractics", and at the same time I was fighting an air battle in another room to keep the Luftwaffe from shooting up my tanks using an Avalon-Hill board game. Same thing out at Phil's: we moved from individual adventures using EPT across mass battles using my "Qadardalikoi" miniatures rules to grand strategy using Phil's PRESTAGS sets on his Tekumel maps.

We played the world-settings, historical or fictional, and we used any and every set of rules that we had to make the games happen.

As to what I want to talk about, well, I'm not fond of that approach - I am not the kind of person who likes to preach to people, or tell them what they should be doing in their games. (At best, I can tell you what we used to do, at a certain time and place, and offer tools for you to use in your games if they should like they might be useful to you.) I've had people telling me what I must do in my games for forty-plus years, and I don't want to be one of those people.

What I prefer to do is answer your questions; I work better that way, I've found. This is what I'm not getting from gamers, or from the various forums I've been a part of.

[True Black Raven]

Then someone else said

I'd be stunned if a Braunstein guy wouldn't be welcomed at Dragonsfoot, or Knights & Knaves or the ODD boards. Your expertise is so rare and unusual and certainly your tales of setting immersion over rules mechanics would be greatly appreciated.

Here's something I've noticed about RPG forums - rules are easy to bicker about on the web whereas discussing immersion and "how to" chats about setting design are harder for most people. But those conversations are often the most valuable.

But perhaps a blog is more useful for you than forums. Certainly, if you take the time to discuss your experience with the 3 original settings of the hobby, those conversations deserve some sort of permanence. 

I'd be stunned if a Braunstein guy wouldn't be welcomed at Dragonsfoot, or Knights & Knaves or the ODD boards. Your expertise is so rare and unusual and certainly your tales of setting immersion over rules mechanics would be greatly appreciated.

@chirinebakal replied

Be stunned. I found that I am a heretic with both Arnesonians and Gygaxians. I say good things about Gary, so Arnesonians don't like me' because I say good things about Dave, Arnesonians don't like me. It made going to Gary Con very awkward, but Luke has a very good attitude about this and we had a very good weekend together.

My problem is that I say things that challenge the established mythologies of the game hobby, and people get very upset and have issues with it; I am questioning their beliefs, after all. I had a very front row seat for the Great Lawsuit, and it was heartbreaking to watch two very gifted guys tear each other apart.

In the interests of full disclosure, I was the 'Vice President of Tekumel Affairs' at Adventure Games, and worked for Dave for something like six years, as well as gaming with him for over a decade. (I was a founding member of GAMA, as well.) Dave used to send me down to TSR stockholders' meetings to vote his stock shares, which is how I got to know Gary; I'd ask the questions that Brian and Kevin didn't want asked 'on the record'. They'd blow me off, and Gary would say "I think this young man has raised an interesting point, and I like to hear the answer."

I do have a blog, as well as a Photobucket page and a You Tube channel. I have a section of links on the blog to a number of people who I think are worth listening to - and who very often have very different views that I do. I assume that people will disagree with me, which is why I give a place for different voices on my blog.

I'd be happy to talk about Blackmoor and my time there, but you should be aware that quite a few Blackmoor fans get upset when I do; our game play with Dave does not seem to fit within the 'established mythology' that they have come up with.

My personal favorite message from a gamer - "Why aren't you dead yet?"

@chirinebakal just for the record, I don't think there are more than a tiny few who are Arnesonians (worshippers) and Gygaxians (worshippers) on this forum. I think there are the majority that are fond of both and want to see Arneson get his due without it being viewed as dissing Gygax. As someone else said you can respect both for what they did to bring D&D to us without having to hate on either one of them. They are only human and like all of us made their share of mistakes.  I think all of us would love to know more about playing those original games before anything was published.

You can say good things about both here, for we are very sick of hearing the bad stuff. The bad stuff is TMI.

[True Black Raven]

In no particular order:

Arnesonians believe that Dave Arneson invented role-playing, and that Gary Gygax stole it from him;

Gygaxians believe that Gary Gygax invented role-playing, and Dave Arneson stole it from him;

Barkerites believe that Prof. M. A. R. Barker invented role-playing, and that Arneson and Gygax stole it from him;

Weselyians (not the Methodist kind) believe that all of the above are full of it, and just get on with playing the game - named after Dave Wesely, a friend of mine and the creator of the 'Braunstein' style of game.

I am a Weselyian.

And yes, these people - the vast majority of whom didn't know any of The Big Three personally - are having knock-down, drag-out arguments over the relative merits of their particular saints. I've found that expressing opinions based on my time with any and all of them is a sure-fire way to cause trouble.



Dave Wesely, on the other hand, does not care and gets on with the game.

Yeah, I agree lets just play the game, whichever one is on for tonight. None of them were saints and neither are any of us.

@chirinebakal , I think I missed something, what is named after Dave Wesely?

IIRC Dave Arneson credited Dave Wesely with the idea of the roleplaying game which Dave Arneson then implemented. If I understand it correctly Dave Wesely was not happy (at least for a while) with how the "Braunstein" games went while Dave Arneson dived in with both feet.

Is that correct?

[True Black Raven]

and that's why my book, "To Serve The Petal Throne", is now up to 108,000 words. (I expect to go to a total of 300,000.) I'm trying to give a sense of that time and place, and the people who inhabited it...

Fascinating!!! I am really interested in this! There are three video clips that I think really show what their play style was like:

Dave:

This is the short film, "Duel at Blood Creek"; Dave's style was usually fast, furious, and chaotic.

Gary:

This is the animated short, "A Gentleman's Duel", by Blur Studio; Gary's style was more 'linear', with a pretty straightforward plot line / story arc, but all sorts of stuff happened along the way to keep you guessing.

Phil:

This is a clip from the film "The Siege of Jotapata"; Phil was very 'linear', with well-developed story arcs. However, we had a very large degree of that I think is now called 'player character agency', in that we were quite free to try just about any sort of derring-do we wanted to...

SO this is all context leading up to the start of the first Q&A thread. [the last video was blocked This video contains content from BBC Worldwide, who has blocked it on copyright grounds.] So I guess we will just have to see the whole film for the last one.

[True Black Raven]

I for one would like to ask @chirinebakal, but I think first I should read the three threads and see what things have already been answered.

[Crimhthan The Great]

See my first question for @chirinebakal in this thread Rules for playing a Braunstein.

[Admin Pete]

@chirinebakal, the two video links above that work are classics, and I can well understand why both Dave and Gary enjoyed each other as the ref.

[ripx187]

This is very well written True Black Raven and definitely worthy of an Exalt. Now if you can just summarize and make sense of the rest of that mess like you did this part I might give you another one! 


Seriously though, this is good stuff and a very different approach to gaming than what I am used to. 

[Admin Pete]

Jun 14, 2018 17:39:01 GMT -5 ripx187 said:

This is very well written True Black Raven and definitely worthy of an Exalt. Now if you can just summarize and make sense of the rest of that mess like you did this part I might give you another one! 


Seriously though, this is good stuff and a very different approach to gaming than what I am used to. 

I must be a little slow today, what am I missing here?

[Hexenritter Verlag]

Jun 15, 2018 10:18:25 GMT -5 Admin Pete said:

Jun 14, 2018 17:39:01 GMT -5 ripx187 said:

This is very well written True Black Raven and definitely worthy of an Exalt. Now if you can just summarize and make sense of the rest of that mess like you did this part I might give you another one! 


Seriously though, this is good stuff and a very different approach to gaming than what I am used to. 

I must be a little slow today, what am I missing here?

I think ripx187, is referring to the whole thread of content that True Black Raven posted, but I could be wrong & itwas something more specific.

[ripx187]

Yes, this is complimenting the thread as a whole, especially Raven's original remarks. Then a tease that implied that I expected him to summarize the 800 pages linked as well, which I don't. He did a great job of cataloguing! 

[Deleted]

I am not very sorry that the RPGsite thread seems to be such a mess; it is, in the final analysis, a bunch of friends sitting around in the corner booth in the pub/bar having a chat. As I have mentioned several times, I work much better in a Q&A format then anything else; the people who ask me their questions get the best and most honest answer that I can give, based on what I know and have experienced. Hence the lack of 'organization' which I have been taken to task for by several people on that site. If it needs moderation, I'd be happy to work with whomever wants to take on the task.

If I may, I would like to very respectfully remind people that if you want me to participate in a discussion, please take the time to e-mail me ([e-mail]) to let me know what's going on. Due to my schedule, I do not look at the Internet all that much, and usually do so in response to prompts from a forum that I have message traffic. I will try to get back to people as soon as I can, but please be patient; I have a pretty full schedule, most of the time. This month, for example, I've had a large game every weekend: Shieldmaidens, 5E, Free RPG Day (tomorrow, at nine am, and I still have to load the car), and Shieldmaidens again. As you can see from the photos on my blog, these my archaic style of gaming does require some time and energy. (Next month, two weekends are booked for the 5e campaign and a speaking engagement out-of-state.)

I don;t mind you talking to me, but I'd like to know if I'm supposed to be participating in the conversation. Thanks!

[Admin Pete]

Jun 15, 2018 22:48:32 GMT -5 @chirinebakal said:

I am not very sorry that the RPGsite thread seems to be such a mess; it is, in the final analysis, a bunch of friends sitting around in the corner booth in the pub/bar having a chat. As I have mentioned several times, I work much better in a Q&A format then anything else; the people who ask me their questions get the best and most honest answer that I can give, based on what I know and have experienced. Hence the lack of 'organization' which I have been taken to task for by several people on that site. If it needs moderation, I'd be happy to work with whomever wants to take on the task.

If I may, I would like to very respectfully remind people that if you want me to participate in a discussion, please take the time to e-mail me ([e-mail]) to let me know what's going on. Due to my schedule, I do not look at the Internet all that much, and usually do so in response to prompts from a forum that I have message traffic. I will try to get back to people as soon as I can, but please be patient; I have a pretty full schedule, most of the time. This month, for example, I've had a large game every weekend: Shieldmaidens, 5E, Free RPG Day (tomorrow, at nine am, and I still have to load the car), and Shieldmaidens again. As you can see from the photos on my blog, these my archaic style of gaming does require some time and energy. (Next month, two weekends are booked for the 5e campaign and a speaking engagement out-of-state.)

I don;t mind you talking to me, but I'd like to know if I'm supposed to be participating in the conversation. Thanks!

You heard the man, send him an email every now and then, but it doesn't look like he will do any replying until after the weekend.

@chirinebakal, it looks like the mess comment was mainly teasing another poster, but I would agree that any good Q&A thread is a mess, a glorious mess, which is what conversations between friends always are.

[Admin Pete]

Everyone else, lets try to get all the questions for @chirinebakal in this thread and not all over the forum or if they really need to be in another thread, then let him know that.

[mormonyoyoman]

Jun 16, 2018 7:14:01 GMT -5 Admin Pete said:

Everyone else, lets try to get all the questions for @chirinebakal in this thread and not all over the forum or if they really need to be in another thread, then let him know that.

Check.

Even with my predilection for reintroducing chaos when things get too serious.

[ripx187]

@chirinebakal, I apologize if I offended you, I was just being a ham. Truth be told, I'm just a hillbilly who is interested. Gamemastering to me is an art, and like any art, one must study the masters. As I have said elsewhere, you have a very unique approach to gaming. The incorporated wargame that formed the foundation of RPG has been kind of lost. I mean, there are hints that it is there, but for the average joe who picked up these books decades later, we simply lacked the fundamentals that were implied. This, I feel, is where the game changed. Whether it a good change or a bad change is moot, but from my perspective, I am deeply interested in war games, especially how they can be applied to tabletop games. I am in the process of unlearning as I have discovered that much of what I believed to be facts was nothing more than uneducated opinion.

I never got to play with any of the big names that float around our hobby, I was born after the glory days of Avalon Hill, and didn't even know that a wargaming community was even around. My first experience was setting up Star Wars figures and stealing game parts as a child just to see what would happen. I had no idea what I was doing, but I had fun doing it. Enough fun to put up with everybody calling me weird.

I always did enjoy collecting and painting figures, but man is that aspect of the hobby expensive. I have a hodgepodge of lead, but collecting monsters is really difficult. When I do set up the table it is 1:1 melee scale, setting up an orc ambush looks horrible. I've got 3 lead orcs and the rest are little tiny game pieces that I borrow from my Lord of the Rings RISK game, which is far from impressive. The players are terrified of the lead orcs but laugh at the little ones. At my local shop, it isn't very helpful, there isn't much demand for what I want. There are the Warhammer boxes but those things are way beyond my price range, not to mention that they are made of plastic which I find dubious and a horrible value. 

My question is, do you have any tips or words of wisdom for buying the right figures, a decent number of them without going overboard, and maybe some secret for acquiring them without having to go without eating for a few weeks Is it just me or does one have to spend more now than they used to? How do you do it?

[Deleted]

The quick answer is, "a bit at a time." Chirine has been building up his miniatures collection literally since the mid 1970s. When a local game shop, "The Little Tin Soldier Shop," had a "broken figures for cheap" box he spent hours and hours sorting through it for bargain basement figures. That's just one example.

Mostly, "a bit at a time over a long time."

(Also, ask him about the Chinese war rockets!  )

[Deleted]

Jun 16, 2018 7:12:18 GMT -5 Admin Pete said:

You heard the man, send him an email every now and then, but it doesn't look like he will do any replying until after the weekend.

Back tomorrow, most likely. Long day today; the game session went from 10:15 am to 8:45 pm, with no breaks; I was fed at the table through the kindness of friends. Had an average of five to six players all day, with eight players at peak times. Talked to over twenty people about Tekumel and Ye Olde Gaming as we played. Off to get some sleep, if folks would excuse me...

[Deleted]

Jun 10, 2018 21:32:49 GMT -5 True Black Raven said:

Yeah, I agree lets just play the game, whichever one is on for tonight. None of them were saints and neither are any of us.

@chirinebakal , I think I missed something, what is named after Dave Wesely?

IIRC Dave Arneson credited Dave Wesely with the idea of the roleplaying game which Dave Arneson then implemented. If I understand it correctly Dave Wesely was not happy (at least for a while) with how the "Braunstein" games went while Dave Arneson dived in with both feet.

Is that correct?

1. Try:  en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wesleyan_Church

2. Yes. That's what they told me.

[Deleted]

Jun 16, 2018 12:13:38 GMT -5 ripx187 said:

@chirinebakal , I apologize if I offended you, I was just being a ham. Truth be told, I'm just a hillbilly who is interested. Gamemastering to me is an art, and like any art, one must study the masters. As I have said elsewhere, you have a very unique approach to gaming. The incorporated wargame that formed the foundation of RPG has been kind of lost. I mean, there are hints that it is there, but for the average joe who picked up these books decades later, we simply lacked the fundamentals that were implied. This, I feel, is where the game changed. Whether it a good change or a bad change is moot, but from my perspective, I am deeply interested in war games, especially how they can be applied to tabletop games. I am in the process of unlearning as I have discovered that much of what I believed to be facts was nothing more than uneducated opinion.

I never got to play with any of the big names that float around our hobby, I was born after the glory days of Avalon Hill, and didn't even know that a wargaming community was even around. My first experience was setting up Star Wars figures and stealing game parts as a child just to see what would happen. I had no idea what I was doing, but I had fun doing it. Enough fun to put up with everybody calling me weird.

I always did enjoy collecting and painting figures, but man is that aspect of the hobby expensive. I have a hodgepodge of lead, but collecting monsters is really difficult. When I do set up the table it is 1:1 melee scale, setting up an orc ambush looks horrible. I've got 3 lead orcs and the rest are little tiny game pieces that I borrow from my Lord of the Rings RISK game, which is far from impressive. The players are terrified of the lead orcs but laugh at the little ones. At my local shop, it isn't very helpful, there isn't much demand for what I want. There are the Warhammer boxes but those things are way beyond my price range, not to mention that they are made of plastic which I find dubious and a horrible value. 

My question is, do you have any tips or words of wisdom for buying the right figures, a decent number of them without going overboard, and maybe some secret for acquiring them without having to go without eating for a few weeks Is it just me or does one have to spend more now than they used to? How do you do it?

1. No offense taken. The thing is a disorganized mess, and that's that. If somebody wants to organize up my thoughts, they are more then welcome to do it; I have neither the time, the stamina, the energy, or the skills needed to do it.

2. Agreed. It can be too expensive, and it's why I don't buy many of the current product lines

3. Buy low, and take your time. Yes, I have over 5,000 miniatures in the game room, and I measure my scenery by the cubic meter. But I've also been at this for forty years, and I buy a little here and a little there when and if I can get pricing that I can afford. And, to be honest, it helps that the kind of thing that I like usually gets sold at deep discounts when it goes out of fashion; I've gotten a lot of my stuff at pet stores, for example. Buy only what you like and want, and only what's useful in your gaming and with which your game group will have some fun. Look at plastics; they are often cheaper - see also the WizKids and Reaper lines - and usually have what normal gamers want / need for their games. Being different, I keep costs down by using them as conversion fodder for my needs.

Does any of this help?

[mormonyoyoman]

Jun 17, 2018 15:50:00 GMT -5 @chirinebakal said:

Jun 10, 2018 21:32:49 GMT -5 True Black Raven said:

Yeah, I agree lets just play the game, whichever one is on for tonight. None of them were saints and neither are any of us.

@chirinebakal , I think I missed something, what is named after Dave Wesely?

IIRC Dave Arneson credited Dave Wesely with the idea of the roleplaying game which Dave Arneson then implemented. If I understand it correctly Dave Wesely was not happy (at least for a while) with how the "Braunstein" games went while Dave Arneson dived in with both feet.

Is that correct?

1. Try: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wesleyan_Church

2. Yes. That's what they told me.

I have no idea who said what in the above exchange, so I'm going to pretend it's a hoax, a dream, or an imaginary tale.

[mormonyoyoman]

To whomever asked: Yes, we have to spend more for anything, including things that didn't used to exist.

And now I sound much like my Great Depression Kid dad.

[ripx187]

Jun 17, 2018 16:00:46 GMT -5 @chirinebakal said:

Jun 16, 2018 12:13:38 GMT -5 ripx187 said:

@chirinebakal , I apologize if I offended you, I was just being a ham. Truth be told, I'm just a hillbilly who is interested. Gamemastering to me is an art, and like any art, one must study the masters. As I have said elsewhere, you have a very unique approach to gaming. The incorporated wargame that formed the foundation of RPG has been kind of lost. I mean, there are hints that it is there, but for the average joe who picked up these books decades later, we simply lacked the fundamentals that were implied. This, I feel, is where the game changed. Whether it a good change or a bad change is moot, but from my perspective, I am deeply interested in war games, especially how they can be applied to tabletop games. I am in the process of unlearning as I have discovered that much of what I believed to be facts was nothing more than uneducated opinion.

I never got to play with any of the big names that float around our hobby, I was born after the glory days of Avalon Hill, and didn't even know that a wargaming community was even around. My first experience was setting up Star Wars figures and stealing game parts as a child just to see what would happen. I had no idea what I was doing, but I had fun doing it. Enough fun to put up with everybody calling me weird.

I always did enjoy collecting and painting figures, but man is that aspect of the hobby expensive. I have a hodgepodge of lead, but collecting monsters is really difficult. When I do set up the table it is 1:1 melee scale, setting up an orc ambush looks horrible. I've got 3 lead orcs and the rest are little tiny game pieces that I borrow from my Lord of the Rings RISK game, which is far from impressive. The players are terrified of the lead orcs but laugh at the little ones. At my local shop, it isn't very helpful, there isn't much demand for what I want. There are the Warhammer boxes but those things are way beyond my price range, not to mention that they are made of plastic which I find dubious and a horrible value. 

My question is, do you have any tips or words of wisdom for buying the right figures, a decent number of them without going overboard, and maybe some secret for acquiring them without having to go without eating for a few weeks Is it just me or does one have to spend more now than they used to? How do you do it?

1. No offense taken. The thing is a disorganized mess, and that's that. If somebody wants to organize up my thoughts, they are more then welcome to do it; I have neither the time, the stamina, the energy, or the skills needed to do it.

2. Agreed. It can be too expensive, and it's why I don't buy many of the current product lines

3. Buy low, and take your time. Yes, I have over 5,000 miniatures in the game room, and I measure my scenery by the cubic meter. But I've also been at this for forty years, and I buy a little here and a little there when and if I can get pricing that I can afford. And, to be honest, it helps that the kind of thing that I like usually gets sold at deep discounts when it goes out of fashion; I've gotten a lot of my stuff at pet stores, for example. Buy only what you like and want, and only what's useful in your gaming and with which your game group will have some fun. Look at plastics; they are often cheaper - see also the WizKids and Reaper lines - and usually have what normal gamers want / need for their games. Being different, I keep costs down by using them as conversion fodder for my needs.

Does any of this help?

Incredibly! Ral Partha was always my favourite, but Reaper is up there as well. 

If RPG is a fringe hobby, those of us that enjoy collecting and painting miniatures is even smaller. Anyone that I meet who enjoys it as well is a real treat to talk to.

I do incorporate it the best that I can in the game, and I was close to being lynched when I even suggested playing without a grid. I mean it got ugly, and these people actually love me! So we stick to the grid and all of its limitations.

[mormonyoyoman]

"miniatures is even smaller"

I see what you did there.

[Admin Pete]

I've never played with any kind of grid for wilderness adventures. I do use paper with light quarter inch squares in dungeons to draw on.

[Q Man]

Jun 18, 2018 14:56:31 GMT -5 mormonyoyoman said:

"miniatures is even smaller"

I see what you did there.

Wow, that is small!

[True Black Raven]

Jun 14, 2018 17:39:01 GMT -5 ripx187 said:

This is very well written True Black Raven and definitely worthy of an Exalt. Now if you can just summarize and make sense of the rest of that mess like you did this part I might give you another one! 


Seriously though, this is good stuff and a very different approach to gaming than what I am used to. 

Thank you!  There is a lot there and well worth the read.

[Q Man]

Part III is up to 14 pages and growing.

He has good taste in music.